RomRaider

You're now one of the few running JECs I can attest to the DW smoothness. Not a deal breaker in my book, but a benefit I deserve after installing injectors and plugs in 28 degree weather.... at night... in a parking lot.

Before the DW install I too noticed smoother part boost acceleration when I zerod out the tables. I suppose I'll log pulse width against expected to see if any other compensation tables are in effect.

Absolutely. I believe in the DW injectors all the way and I would much rather be running those injectors. The JECS have a 4 hole orifice and the DW 740s have 12 holes (IIRC). The atomization has to be better. I bought and installed the JECS when there was no such thing as DW I'd swap over to the DWs but I just can't bring myself to spend the money. In all honesty, I want 2 sets of injectors so that I can always swap in a freshly cleaned set each year. I saw your post (I think) for your JECS (or somebody else's) on IWSTI. I would have bought them had they been a little bit cheaper - but that is asking too much (lol). I'm on the prowl for another set of JECS for the purpose of swapping each year. A small flow variance in one injector can lead to lean det and pop a ringland when running an aggressive tune. Now, I don't run aggressive tunes anymore. My timing is stupid low for a VF39 - like 11d on a 21psi spoolup (3000rpms). But, it leaves me room for safety now that I don't run Torco for safety anymore.

t

DW 550 & 650 have the 12 hole.

DW 740 is a 4 hole with a new tip welded on, but unlike the JECs is configured for a V spray pattern that matches our heads.

DW 850 is like a cut injector with a new smaller ring opening added to cut down on the width of the conical spray pattern. No wet walls with these.

DW web page is a little ambiguous.

And one has to be careful when speaking of atomization. The cut stockers actually provide the best misting and atomization, but too much actually. There needs to be enough mass to the particles of the injection stream to make it deep enough into the cylinder from the injection point in the heads. This is where the V spray pattern becomes most valuable. This is what I was told by both respective owners of DW and Witchhunter.

Oh, and my price is fair for the JECs. Its what I paid for them before getting them cleaned and tested. Man up on that peak torque timing as well! You're sounding old. Conserva... what?!

Thanks for the info on the DWs.

Yes - your price is totally fair. I did not mean to imply that is was not. I'm just on the hunt for really good deals. With everyone using the DW injectors and with most knowing that the DW injectors are superior, I'm just *hoping* to find a deal on another set of JECS. Additionally, I don't need the harness clips - and, as always, I have to factor in the cost of sending them off to WH for analysis. No matter who I buy injectors from - even if they are from my best friend - I would still send them off to an injector service for analysis. Fact is, these injectors are big enough such that a small variation can cause major issues. I'm already a bit worried that I have run these injectors for too long. Yea, I'm a worry wort.

I've done all sorts of crazy tunes from mild to wild on my motor at this point. As of now, the low timing approach is still getting me good torque and power according to airboy's spreadsheet (309/354). Although, admittedly, I had a bit more when running torco and more timing (340/370). That being said, I am liking this tune. I feel like I have a reasonable amount of room for error for a daily driver.

Now I just need to get a header and I think I will have every mod imaginable for a stock turbo (lol). Although, I don't plan to be running the stock turbo for too much longer. I got a great deal on a SZ49 fatboy so that is actually on the way to me right now (after it goes through DBs transfer of warranty service). It only has the 7cm housing but it wasn't worth upgrading to the 8cm given that the entire reason that I bought the turbo was due to the price. I would have appreciated having the Dom III a lot more but that was 700 more than I spent for the SZ49.

t

No pob.

I just installed a FP Green 7cm with the 2.4'' inlet (used of course, cheap!). I performed a little wastegate porting on the inner lip and haven't seen any creep, even in 30 degree weather. I think you might enjoy the 7cm as spool comes on nicely hitting 18 psi at about 3500rpm +/- and hold nicely to red line. I love it when new fads start in this community and people race to dump perfectly good equipment. $1700 for a new turbo?! Screw that.

I'm really sorry for driving things here OT though

wrong. DW is local to me and I have known them for years.

The only thing Gordon did was flowtest, before DW got the king-of-the-line machine, since then they don't use any of his services.

All R&D, manufacturing, testing, and sales are done by DW.

You seem all sorts of pissy

Maybe the injector work Gordon claimed was just the cleaning. Perhaps when he stated this was "years ago", it was before you knew DW. In any case, I fail to see whats wrong with the claims made.

not pissy my friend. Just loyal to a really good vendor who bends over backwards for Subaru enthusiasts like you, and me. My only objection was your phrasing... "gordon does THE injector work" vs the correct "gordon does injector work". Nothing wrong with that as I'm sure that's what you meant. Don't read too much into online text statements.




has anyone had the stones/4-channel EGT to zero these and test out the consequences?

Are you talking about per cylinder power balancing by means of EGT's?

I am afraid this approach is not as promising for gasoline engines as it is for diesel ones.. Too many unknowns are involved besides per cylinder fuel balancing. Different cylinder VE efficiencies thru RPM range due to the intake manifold shape, different flame development times and propagation speeds (VE, in cylinder temperature, ignition timing, plug conditions dependant, etc.).

From the other hand those EGT measurements\balancing are quite reasonable for per cylinder engine protection under full load.

In cylinder realtime pressure measurements seem to be the only correct way for gasoline engine balancing. Unfortunately this is currently not available for OS community.

No, I meant zeroing the per-injector PW compensations, and watching for deviations in EGT (assuming zero'd per-cylinder timing comps). It may reveal Subaru's knowledge of flow imbalance in head castings, intake manifolds, exhaust manifolds, or all three.

just want to bump this and say that I have had the same experience with DW 815cc sidefeeds (custom set, same physical structure as the 850s).

After doing some header research I had a though about this.

Rather than 1-4 -> A-D maybe they're lined up by firing order. Meaning the firing order is 1-3-2-4 so
A=1
B=3
C=2
D=4

Now looking at the manifold design, cylinders 3 and 4 scavenge of 1 and 2. Therefore you would have to shorting the pulse wide in 1 and 2 and making in longer in 3 and 4 would make sense.

In terms of A,B,C,D that would mean B and D would have have positive values While A and C have negative values.

Looking at the 08 sti values, thats exactly what's going on.


I would love to see what happens when someone running EL hearders zeros out the comps.

Those corrections should be RPM and EngineLoad dependent (3D tables).

And it is hard to believe that they may be road calibrated.

bump to this, wondering whether anyone ever figured anything else out about why Subaru did this.

My bet is that Subaru was attempting to compensate for statistically significant differences in the intake manifold for each cylinder. That and possibly combustion differences as well. Heck maybe there are thermal reasons behind varying the fuel delivery per cylinder. I'd also assume they used some very expensive equipment on a mounted engine to calibrate these tables as well.

Of course swapping injectors throws the viability of these tables out the door, hence why people like me zeroed them out.